Thorens vs Origin Live

I serviced a Thorens TD115 turntable for a customer a few weeks ago and fitted an Audio Technica AT440MLa cartridge, being a favourite of mine, with a line contact diamond, ability to track at less than 1.5g, and a good clean natural sound. I think the price of $275 is very reasonable for the technology it incorporates and I don't know of any other cartridge on the market that has a line contact diamond for less than $300.

Having serviced many Thorens turntables in the past I was expecting this one to perform pretty well and was disappointed with the sound compared to what I am used to. The customer was disappointed too, particularly as he had recently purchased a $3000 CD player and was hoping to be able to achieve better from his vinyl collection.

He asked me what he would need to spend to get better sound and as I usually do I recommended the Pro-Ject RPM6.1SB in the $1500 price bracket and an Origin Live Aurora in the $3000 price bracket. He then asked about the Thorens TD309, which retails for about $2500 including an Audio Technica AT95B cartridge. Well I had to admit I didn't know. The TD309 has had some good reviews overseas. So I told him I would set up comparison demonstration between the TD309 and an Aurora. The Aurora doesn't come with a specific tonearm so any with a Rega geometry can be fitted, so I chose an Origin Live Onyx because at $770 on top of the Aurora's base price of $1650 it was similar in price to the TD309 (ignoring the AT95B cartridge which is only worth about $50).

This was to be a very interesting comparison for me, probably more than for the customer. Consider the differences. Thorens is a international company that has been operating for over 125 years, has distributors all over the world, and impressive engineering and manufacturing credentials. Origin Live is almost a one man show. Mark Baker has been operating since the late 80s, has a small factory in Southhampton, and about 5 staff - a typical small business. Thorens have the resources of a large corporation, with the accompanying overheads, but also no doubt excellent technical and industrial design expertise. As they sell via a network of distributors with their markups how do their products compare on value for money terms with those of a lean small business? With Origin Live you have a small organisation selling direct to dealers like myself and avoiding the chain of markups.

As a small businessman myself I would like to think that in the hi fi arena big does not necessarily mean best, and value for money might be found with small manufacturers such as Graham Slee Products, The Cartridge Man, The Disc Doctor, and Origin Live.

So I ordered a TD309 and an Aurora MkII. Because Thorens are distributed in Australia the TD309 arrived in 2 days from Melbourne. But to my surprise the Aurora arrived only a day later from the UK.

The TD309 was quite easy to set up, particularly because the tonearm and cartridge were already fitted. The supplied power pack did not work but was easily replaced. The subplatter wouldn't turn because the mount for the motor had come out of its housing, and there was oil on the base which had leaked from the main bearing during transport - easily cleaned up. When I hooked up the TD309 to my current lounge system I was immediately impressed and thought "this is going to be hard to beat at this price".

While listening to the LPs from the Thorens 125 year 3LP set I started setting up the Aurora. There is a bit more involved. After unpacking, the main bearing has to be oiled and the spindle inserted, checking that there is enough oil to fill it completely. Then the tonearm had to be installed. This involves feeding the cables through the mounting hole, then mounting the cartridge, then fitting the counterweight, aligning the cartridge, setting the tracking force, adjusting the tonearm height for correct vertical tracking angle (VTA), and attaching the anti-skating weight and thread. After setting all these parameters the main nut on the tonearm shaft is tightened to hold everything in position. The motor pod also has to be positioned, the platter put on the bearing and the belt put on. So there's definitely more involved with the Aurora, but when someone buys one from me I do all that setting up anyway.

In order to do a fair comparison I decided to use the same cartridge on both turntables, so I mounted an AT440MLa on each one. Now, cartridges or more specifically stylus assemblies, need time to "run in" but to avoid this factor I decided to simply move the stylus assembly from the TD115 which had been played for more than 10 hours to each of these turntables. I also connected each turntable to the same Graham Slee Reflex M phono preamp thus eliminating that as a variable. This meant I couldn't do quick A-B switching but it only took a few seconds to swap the stylus assembly and the leads each time.

Having already listened to the TD309 (with the AT95B) for quite some time I changed to the Aurora (with Onyx tonearm and AT440MLa). The difference was immediately obvious but not life changing. There was certainly better definition of instruments, and a much bigger sound stage, also better transients, but that might have been the difference between the AT440MLa (on the Aurora) and the AT95B (on the TD309). So I swapped the stylus assembly to the TD309 and continued listening. The AT440MLa provides more detail than the AT95B, but I felt the Aurora was overall clearer. Further listening of a variety of tracks culminated in a heavy orchestral & choral track. On the TD309 at realistic volume levels the sound was hard to listen to and there was a sensation of wanting to turn it down. With the Aurora, although still not perfect, the individual elements of the music were discernible and the overall difference in clarity was obvious.

So one thing I have learnt from this exercise is that music that is relatively simple eg jazz, or popular music is mixed so well that many turntable/tonearm/cartridge combinations will be able to separate the elements convincingly, although there will still be differences in positioning, depth of image, and transients. But the real test is complex music, only the better combinations will be able to provide a convincing disassembly.

Having set this up I invited my customer to come and have a listen. He brought with him the Dire Straights Love over Gold LP, and asked for the Telegraph Road track to be played. On the TD309 it sounded great, nothing to criticize really. But when we changed to the Aurora the sound stage was wider and deeper, overall it was much clearer, the drums were much cleaner, particularly the attack of a note. In contrast one might call the TD309 soft and blurred. The customer agreed the Aurora with Onyx is the better combination.

Since that demo I have listened to many more records and used different cartridges on both the TD309 and the Aurora. The overall result is that the Aurora provides the clearer sound from vinyl. That doesn't mean the Thorens is bad, in fact some people might prefer it. And some speakers will magnify the difference, on others it will be less noticeable. And the type of music you play also will affect your choice. There are other factors also; both the TD309 and Aurora are not conventionally shaped and don't come with dust covers (we provide one for either). This can result in a low WAF (wife acceptance factor).

So what are the conclusions? There's no doubt in my mind that smaller manufacturers can compete with major ones in the hi fi arena and provide products that outperform their competition in the same price range. The lack of a distributor helps in this regard in providing superior value for money due the lower mark ups from cost of manufacture to retail price. The downside is that most distributors have established dealer networks, authorised repair service agents, and carry spares in Australia. How important this is with a specialized product like a hi fi turntable is debatable; because of my direct relationship with the Origin Live factory I can get replacement parts within a few days from the UK.

So I have been very happy that I sell Origin Live products and believe they offer excellent value for money, and the above experiment reinforces that belief. Origin Live have an excellent brochure on their System Philosophy with regard to turntables. You can download it here.

As an additional note it seems that the deck and particularly the tonearm contribute more to the overall sound than the cartridge. Linn demonstrated this years ago when they would fit a top cartridge to an entry level LP12 and compare it to an LP12 with all the latest upgrades they were offering but a modest cartridge. The second combination always sounded better. This has implications for anyone wanting to buy a turntable or upgrade their current one. Most people buy a new more expensive cartridge and put it on their existing deck, or buy upgrades for the turntable hoping it will transform it into a higher performance sphere. In most cases it's much better to buy a new turntable than spend an equivalent amount on upgrades.

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